Interview: Rivers and Rust
Photo by Jessica Franco
August 1, 2017
Omnisound talked to Rivers and Rust after their show in Los Angeles opening for Counting Crows and Matchbox Twenty. The duo, comprised of Sheila Marshall and Kyle Cook, had a lot to say about their musical process and life on the road.
OS Mag: Omnisound Magazine covered your set opening for Matchbox Twenty and Counting Crows at The Forum last night. What was your favorite part of this tour stop? How was LA different from the other venues you’ve played at so far on this tour?
Kyle: LA is just...other than the traffic, probably one of the most desirable cities in the United States to be in so it kinda goes without saying. Perfect weather, the beach. But, that aside, The Forum which has a special rich history is - not only is it rock n roll culture but it’s music culture in general. I mean, you know, walk up and down those hallways where all the bands - essentially, everybody who ever mattered played there. Did you get a chance to look at all the names on the entry way?
Sheila: Yeah, it was really cool. I think most musicians dream about playing at The Forum. You hear about it your whole career and you’re like ‘I wanna play there one day!’ so I think that was really cool.
Kyle: Yeah and I think for me, that’s the coolest thing about the LA style. Between that and the Hollywood Bowl are a couple of the most iconic. Not to mention, I’m a big fan of architecture so I really love the image of the Forum. You probably feel the same way Sheila, the image of the Forum, we all kinda know those pillars and architecture. As a kid, the idea of the Forum’s almost been ingrained in you and so I feel like now that we’ve played it, that’s a huge achievement for a band that doesn’t have a full length album out yet.
OS Mag: From waking up to going to sleep, what’s a typical day on the road like for you?
Sheila: We’re traveling most of the time. You know Kyle has another gig he has to do after Rivers and Rust with Matchbox so I usually go to bed early and we’re driving most of the time so I call it a night, wake up around ten and then it's time to start it all over again. So a typical day is sleeping, getting up to play. It’s pretty simple.
Kyle: I must say, she’s got a strong routine. It’s like predictable you know. I tend to get rowdy with people late in the evening and find myself sleeping in a little too late, I get that adrenaline. But you know, her and I end our set around 7, 7:30 at the latest. My adrenaline is kinda going at 11 at night when we close the Matchbox set so I’ve always have a hard time winding down after a set. Actually all the guys in the band are like that. It’s almost like we see each other right before stage and then on stage and then we’re on the same bus but we’re on two different schedules.
OS Mag: Kyle, so you’re half of the duo Rivers and Rust, but you’re also the guitarist for Matchbox Twenty. What’s it like playing two sets in one night?
Kyle: You know, it’s not as taxing as I thought it was gonna be. In some ways, I’m a little more kinda warm for the Matchbox set, to be quite honest because before I wouldn’t have too many responsibilities until eight or so at night. Other than a sound check and a few other things, I could just bum around most of the day and I could just fall back asleep or watch tv. But it keeps me musical early in the day and I like that.
OS Mag: On your website you describe your sound as “a raw mix of soul, rock and Americana.” Can you tell me a little bit more about what that means?/ How would you describe your musical sound?
Kyle: We’re still trying to figure that out.
Sheila: It’s definitely a mix of both of our styles. I’m a little bit more on the bluesy country side I guess.
Kyle: Yeah, but I feel like there’s kind of a cajun - like you know cause you came from East Texas which is a little closer to New Orleans so I do feel like there’s a weird little cajun-y kinda thing that’s in your style as well. Which definitely fits into the bluesier world.
Sheila: I think Kyle’s more of the rock/pop. You know he brings that side to it. Well I mean he’s very versatile, but he definitely brings the rock with the guitar tones.
Kyle: There’s kinda a component from spending years in the recording studio, but she brings this attitude to it that you know is very distinctive. So I think that that’s where the pairing is kinda nice because I think about things more analytically and she thinks of things emotionally like ‘I’m feeling that’ or ‘I’m not feeling that’ no matter how much structure or context there was with it. Which I think is cool. We argue about it sometimes, we kinda clash about it but that’s what artistry is. I’ve seen that very rarely where everybody just goes ‘Yeah that’s perfect. It’s perfect. Let’s go.’ So hopefully whatever the sound we have together is that ongoing argument of push and pull. Like ‘I kinda wanna see this thing kinda happen,’ and ‘I think this should happen.’ And that’s the blend. But it’s tough to put words to it you know, as you develop a group sound, it kinda emerges. People like yourself, Jessie, come in and start defining it. We just know what we like. And then a lot of situations it’s harder for us to describe it. It’s for people like yourself to figure out a way to define it.
OS Mag: Does the name “Rivers and Rust” have any particular meaning?
Kyle: I think it kinda fits in the way that we, you know, when we made the decision to make music together as a duo, there’s the arbitrary task of trying to name it which is almost like trying to name a family. It’s easier to name an individual than it is a group. It’s very random. We had a hard time kinda figuring out what that was. We had a board where we were writing a bunch of - do you remember any of the names we were thinking of before we decided Rivers and Rust?
Sheila: The Hurts, Badlands…
Kyle: Right, stuff with that kinda dusty road, bluesy, pop rock kinda stuff. A friend of a friend suggested it, to be quite honest. It was on the board. We didn’t even know who put it on that dry erase board, as I recall. It’s almost like a nickname that you give somebody. It just sticks and you don’t know how it ends up being that way, but it does kinda sum up the explanation that Sheila was just saying about me bringing that guitar layer and stuff that may be kinda familiar to people who like pop rock music and her bringing the bluesy attitude to it. That clean and dirty aspect of Rivers and Rust that kinda made a little sense.
OS Mag: You recently released the music video for “Welcome to the Show.” What was the process of making the music video like and did anything unexpected happen on set?
Sheila: I think the mannequins were a little scary. We had some blow up dolls as well, that was a little unexpected, the whole concept that everyone’s fake at the end.
Kyle: When we walked in and there was a pile of blow up dolls, that was a little striking. We would post it and we were like ‘we look like some really weird people right now.’ We’re shooting a video with blow up dolls. It’d be real easy to get the wrong idea real quick. But nothing unexpected happened. It was a studio shoot as opposed to a location so all kind of in one place. But props to Mason Dixon who’s a national based director. He’s done a lot of great videos for a lot of country artists and actually some punk bands and some other interesting groups. He’s just a really talented guy. I actually met him through some stuff that we did with Matchbox and then we stayed in touch and he kinda dreamt the whole thing up. And we were like ‘Ok cool. As long as we look good in it. You do your thing bro.’
OS Mag: How do you normally go about writing a song? What is your creative process like?
Sheila: Usually when we get together I just have an idea or Kyle has an idea and we usually go off of that and work on it. Like “Welcome to the Show” that was just a little riff on the guitar and it became a song. That’s pretty much how that one went. So it goes both ways. And I just bring my ideas on my phone.
Kyle: I’ve really started encouraging her more to just capture every little idea that she’s got because I’m just a firm believer that a great song can come from the teeniest, tiniest, little idea. In Nashville, people write songs around titles all the time. Literally, they have a title and that’s it. They don’t know how the melody goes, they can’t hum you anything, there’s no guitar riffs and it’s almost like looking at a color and saying ‘What does that say to you?’ and everyone kinda just speaks at once and then you figure out a way to put a sentence together. So she had a bunch of little ideas. There were several things on the EP like “Light it all.” I’m sorry not “Light it all,” “Money.” She had this stuff like ‘I want money, money, money.’ Like all this kinda bluesy sort of riff and stuff vocally and there was sort of a title in there and she was like ‘I dont know’ and she’s about ready to go onto the next one and I’m like ‘No it’s great, let’s write that.’ So it’s interesting how songs can eventually evolve out of a very small idea and it kinda just reminds you that, you know, it doesn’t actually take a lot to be a songwriter you just have to craft it. Songs don’t always just show up and arrive all as one piece. But I’d say the phone, to answer your question, the phone is the beginning of everything.
OS Mag: Outside of music, how do you enjoy spending your time?
Sheila: I have dogs so I’m with my dogs.
Kyle: She’s a collector of chihuahuas.
Sheila: I’ve got Chachi, Coco, and Charlie. Those are my dogs. I had four, but one died.
Kyle: Those are her kids.
Sheila: I just chill with my dogs to be honest. I know it sounds boring, but that’s pretty much what I do for fun. I also love to travel so that’s just one reason I love going on tour. I like to travel as much as I can.
Kyle: She does a lot of stuff for the military. She’s been to Iraq. And did you go to Korea too? And play for the troops?
Sheila: Yeah, Korea, Kuwait, Iraq, Japan, Europe.
Kyle: She does a lot for the military. But yeah traveling’s gotta be a component in there for sure. As far as me, man, I’m probably unhealthily - if that’s a word - attached to music. It’s a bit of an obsession. Yeah I’m kind of a studio rat. I’ll take vacations every now and then but I get quite a bit of that fix on tour so when I’m home I always say I’m gonna like pick up a hobby or something, but I always end up at the studio writing music or working on something that I’ve already started. I like to play basketball.
Sheila: Kyle doesn’t even really like TV. I’m always like ‘Have you seen this show?’ ‘No.’ ‘Have you seen this show?’ ‘No.’
Kyle: I was literally sitting with Wilmer, I can’t remember his last name. He was there last night and he’s been a fan of Matchbox for a very long time. He always comes if he’s in town to LA shows. I felt like an idiot cuz we were sitting there talking and there’s this song on the very first Matchbox record called “Hang” that’s the last track on our debut album and he’s like ‘Man that’s my fuckin’ karaoke jam, man.’ And then we started talking and I was like ‘Well what are you doing now?’ I knew he was on That 70s Show, but now I guess he’s on NCIS which I imagine has huge ratings. It’s pretty much like a who done it crime kinda show where he’s like a sexy guy that’s saving the world or whatever. And I didn’t know what he was doing. He’s like yeah I’m on the show NCIS. It’s on whatever ABC. And I’m like yeah that sounds like a good gig. Here I am like I don’t even know what the hell he’s up to. So that just demonstrates how hyperfocused I am in the studio cause I don’t watch TV at all really.
OS Mag: So then you’re not hooked on Game of Thrones like the rest of America?
Kyle: I am not, no. As a matter of fact, whoever one of the ladies is in Game of Thrones is on the cover of Rolling Stone and I was asking our drummer Richie, ‘Who is that?’ ‘She’s on Game of Thrones, man!’ I was like ‘Oh.’ So yeah, I’m a little detached from pop culture if it’s not musical.
OS Mag: When was the last time you sang in the shower? Do you remember what you sang?
Kyle: Hmmm, it’s been a while for me, honestly.
Sheila: I would say yesterday. I was warming up.
Kyle: That means you’re a shower singer. It depends on the shower. If it’s bigger, I’m in. Some of these hotels you feel like someone’s on the other side listening to you sing a bad Britney Spears song. I can just imagine someone being there like ‘What the hell is he doing?’
OS Mag: I have one last question for you, here at Omnisound, we want to know what your spirit animal is and why?
Kyle: I’m probably more of a lap dog. I gotta be around people you know.
Sheila: I don’t know. I’ve never thought about this before. I’m gonna say like a horse because when I think of a horse I think about freedom. I really don’t like to be held down or anything. I like my freedom. I’ve always been like that ever since I was a little kid. I always ran away when I was like two years old.
Interview by Jessica Franco
Sheila: Usually when we get together I just have an idea or Kyle has an idea and we usually go off of that and work on it. Like “Welcome to the Show” that was just a little riff on the guitar and it became a song. That’s pretty much how that one went. So it goes both ways. And I just bring my ideas on my phone.
Kyle: I’ve really started encouraging her more to just capture every little idea that she’s got because I’m just a firm believer that a great song can come from the teeniest, tiniest, little idea. In Nashville, people write songs around titles all the time. Literally, they have a title and that’s it. They don’t know how the melody goes, they can’t hum you anything, there’s no guitar riffs and it’s almost like looking at a color and saying ‘What does that say to you?’ and everyone kinda just speaks at once and then you figure out a way to put a sentence together. So she had a bunch of little ideas. There were several things on the EP like “Light it all.” I’m sorry not “Light it all,” “Money.” She had this stuff like ‘I want money, money, money.’ Like all this kinda bluesy sort of riff and stuff vocally and there was sort of a title in there and she was like ‘I dont know’ and she’s about ready to go onto the next one and I’m like ‘No it’s great, let’s write that.’ So it’s interesting how songs can eventually evolve out of a very small idea and it kinda just reminds you that, you know, it doesn’t actually take a lot to be a songwriter you just have to craft it. Songs don’t always just show up and arrive all as one piece. But I’d say the phone, to answer your question, the phone is the beginning of everything.
OS Mag: Outside of music, how do you enjoy spending your time?
Sheila: I have dogs so I’m with my dogs.
Kyle: She’s a collector of chihuahuas.
Sheila: I’ve got Chachi, Coco, and Charlie. Those are my dogs. I had four, but one died.
Kyle: Those are her kids.
Sheila: I just chill with my dogs to be honest. I know it sounds boring, but that’s pretty much what I do for fun. I also love to travel so that’s just one reason I love going on tour. I like to travel as much as I can.
Kyle: She does a lot of stuff for the military. She’s been to Iraq. And did you go to Korea too? And play for the troops?
Sheila: Yeah, Korea, Kuwait, Iraq, Japan, Europe.
Kyle: She does a lot for the military. But yeah traveling’s gotta be a component in there for sure. As far as me, man, I’m probably unhealthily - if that’s a word - attached to music. It’s a bit of an obsession. Yeah I’m kind of a studio rat. I’ll take vacations every now and then but I get quite a bit of that fix on tour so when I’m home I always say I’m gonna like pick up a hobby or something, but I always end up at the studio writing music or working on something that I’ve already started. I like to play basketball.
Sheila: Kyle doesn’t even really like TV. I’m always like ‘Have you seen this show?’ ‘No.’ ‘Have you seen this show?’ ‘No.’
Kyle: I was literally sitting with Wilmer, I can’t remember his last name. He was there last night and he’s been a fan of Matchbox for a very long time. He always comes if he’s in town to LA shows. I felt like an idiot cuz we were sitting there talking and there’s this song on the very first Matchbox record called “Hang” that’s the last track on our debut album and he’s like ‘Man that’s my fuckin’ karaoke jam, man.’ And then we started talking and I was like ‘Well what are you doing now?’ I knew he was on That 70s Show, but now I guess he’s on NCIS which I imagine has huge ratings. It’s pretty much like a who done it crime kinda show where he’s like a sexy guy that’s saving the world or whatever. And I didn’t know what he was doing. He’s like yeah I’m on the show NCIS. It’s on whatever ABC. And I’m like yeah that sounds like a good gig. Here I am like I don’t even know what the hell he’s up to. So that just demonstrates how hyperfocused I am in the studio cause I don’t watch TV at all really.
OS Mag: So then you’re not hooked on Game of Thrones like the rest of America?
Kyle: I am not, no. As a matter of fact, whoever one of the ladies is in Game of Thrones is on the cover of Rolling Stone and I was asking our drummer Richie, ‘Who is that?’ ‘She’s on Game of Thrones, man!’ I was like ‘Oh.’ So yeah, I’m a little detached from pop culture if it’s not musical.
OS Mag: When was the last time you sang in the shower? Do you remember what you sang?
Kyle: Hmmm, it’s been a while for me, honestly.
Sheila: I would say yesterday. I was warming up.
Kyle: That means you’re a shower singer. It depends on the shower. If it’s bigger, I’m in. Some of these hotels you feel like someone’s on the other side listening to you sing a bad Britney Spears song. I can just imagine someone being there like ‘What the hell is he doing?’
OS Mag: I have one last question for you, here at Omnisound, we want to know what your spirit animal is and why?
Kyle: I’m probably more of a lap dog. I gotta be around people you know.
Sheila: I don’t know. I’ve never thought about this before. I’m gonna say like a horse because when I think of a horse I think about freedom. I really don’t like to be held down or anything. I like my freedom. I’ve always been like that ever since I was a little kid. I always ran away when I was like two years old.
Interview by Jessica Franco
